I have my 20 week ultra-sound on Tuesday, Sept. 2nd! This is the one that if we wanted to, we could find out what we're having. I don't think we're going to, though. I've always thought that I would rather be surprised when the baby is born... but the closer we're getting I'm kinda thinking maybe it would be easier to just know. I don't know... thoughts?
On a slightly separate note, for those of you who are keeping tabs, it has been almost 10 whole days since the last time I was actually sick. That's a new record and doubles the old record!! Wooohooo!!! (I've felt like I was going to be sick a few times since... but I haven't and it's still major progress!) Sorry to gross you out, but I'm really excited about it! =)
781 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 401 – 600 of 781 Newer› Newest»It's not the fact whether it happens alot. The point is, it does happen. Now what law should govern this .
And what about the picture of the baby that grabbed the doctors hand. It wasn't exactly removed from the womb, but it was for a short time removed from the mother, and partly out of the womb. What would you define that baby as? A Baby, or a fetus, thus letting it be legally aborted?
If convictions are true, then the principle behind them will survive.
Just because something is morally right or wrong doesn't mean there should be a law to enforce it or prohibit it.
Being a lying adulter is wrong, but should we put McCain in jail just because he is a lying adulterer?
Should we pass an anti-lying Adulterer Law?
Having sex out of wedlock is wrong, but should we put little Tarty Palin in Jail for it? Should we pass anti-tart legislation?
No...
Even God lets people make their own decisions and he is the ultimate judge, not us.
The law and the state are not very good at helping people make personal private decisions. You would realize this if you would think things through a little bit.
And Jeshanah and Sharla think you would be a murderer if you chose the life of your wife over her unborn fetus.
Would you be a murder who should be put to death for making a personal private decision like that?
Putting people to death for making their own decisions, that sounds really swell...
God made a law.
Thou Shalt not Kill
Now there are consequences that should match that law.
Lying is not necessarily always worthy of being thrown in jail. But the punishment should fit the crime.
On the other hand, I'm not saying that every mother who has an abortion should be put to death, but they should be punished. People can look at the situation, and hear the evidence and decide just how much the punishment should be.
I would say if I made that decision, I killed my baby to spare the life of my wife.
If the child were 15 and holding a gun to my wifes head and I shot it, I would have to say I did kill my child to spare the life of my wife.
I would be a killer. A murderer has a slightly different context. I don't believe it is considered murder when it is self defense.
Yeah the Bible says "Thou Shalt not Kill" and yet you will find that on some occasions it's OK to wipe out an entire population, including babies cuz they are Philistines or whatever.
It does not say Thou shalt not kill a fertilized egg or lay out any exceptions does it? Again we are required to make decisions.
Don't some people believe people who use condoms are murderers?
(Judges 21:10-24)
So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children.
Question:
If a rape victim doesn't hunt down and murder her rapist because there is a law that protects his life, does that mean the government is "forcing" to let him live? How is that any different than having a law to protect the life of the unborn, regardless of how they were conceived? Why does a rapist get more rights than his offspring?
I'm all for small government. I LOVE small government. But I also recognize that one of the essential roles of government is to protect those who cannot protect themselves. If outlawing abortion is "big government," then outlawing murder is "big government" too.
(Deuteronomy 22:28-29)
If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.
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HOLY SMOKES, WHAT A PUNISHMENT FOR RAPE!!
Should we reinstitute that one?
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See sometimes the law ain't so clear, thats why sometimes you gotta make your own decisions.
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Oh yeah, I believe Polygamy should be legal too. Just like in the Bible days.
The government shouldn't be forcing anyone to have kids for rapists.
Your example stinks, because if a woman kills a potential rapist, it's self defense, she gets off scott free, gets a key to the city and probably goes on Letterman.
In a gripping personal account of pain and redemption, author Nicole W. Cooley offers a candid look at her rape as a young military officer by a trusted friend.
She relates the devastating emotional consequences of her decision to abort the child conceived during the attack.
"I felt that the abortion was like being raped again," says Cooley. "Only this time, it was much worse because I had consented to the assault." LINK
They might as well force the woman to marry the rapist like in the good ol' days.
What's a lifetime of suffering, they are just women anyway?
After they have the kid for the rapist they should marry him so the kid isn't forced to be illegitimate.
You do bring up a good point Israel, about the Philistines. In fact, I Don't even have an answer for that right now.
I do however do not see how a mother can consider abortion self defense when it is a rapists child she's carrying.
In no way does the child legitamently threaten the life of the mother.
Another stupid example.
An abortion isn't rape, because it requires consent. Rape doesn't.
These aren't easy questions and they don't have easy answers.
That's why the decisions should be between the raped woman and her God, without any government interference.
Big Government is not good at answering hard questions and is terrible at making these kinds of judgments.
My example is great. I didn't say "potential" rapist.
Victim X has been raped by Rapist Y, someone she knows personally. (In fact, it is a well-known statistic that the majority of rapes are committed by someone the victim knows.) Victim X is haunted by the memory of the event every time she sees Rapist Y. So, in order to remove this horrible reminder from her life, she hunts him down and kills him in his sleep, when he is completely defenseless.
You know as well as I do that there is no way she is getting off for "self defense."
Ok the problem I have is that government is letting people make decisions to use abortion as birth control. People are having abortions simply because its more convienient.
Those are the murderers to me, they plan to kill, then they kill, even though the baby poses no threat to them at all.
Why do we have to allow both?!? Why can't there be a law that seperates situation 1 from situation 2?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roe_v._Wade
Roe vs Wade states a woman can have an abortion when the child is "viable", meaning it can survive outside of the mothers womb, so partial birth abortions, like Obama supports, actually goes against Roe vs Wade.
I,of course, completely agree with John on this. If outlawing abortion is "big government" then the basic outlawing of murder is "big government" too. It is the same exact thing.
I still think your example is stupid.
In reality, the Rape Victim in that will probably get off completely due to post-tramautic stress disorder, temporary insanity or some other mitigating circumstance.
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But we cannot let people go around killing other people and then claiming they were raped and then getting an automatic get out of jail free card. Otherwise ex-girlfriends and jilted lovers would do it all the time.
It's a cost-benefit analysis.
Plus the penalty for rape isn't death and the government has the right to impose the punishment, not just some individual.
The government isn't forcing anyone to let someone else live, they are just requiring you to take the proper channels before you put someone to death. People, even accused rapists, have rights.
That's a good thing, no?
"But we cannot let people go around killing other people and then claiming they were raped and then getting an automatic get out of jail free card. Otherwise ex-girlfriends and jilted lovers would do it all the time."
But we cannot let people go around killing their babies and then claiming they were raped and then getting an automatic get out of jail free card. Otherwise ex-girlfriends and jilted lovers would do it all the time.
You just made part of my argument for me. Thanks for making this such an easy argument to win.
Ridiculous.
You do really like simplistic answers don't you Shara? I know simplistic answers are good because they don't require deep thinking and don't strain the old noggin, but bear with me...
Outlawing of murder is not big government.
It also doesn't require the government to force anyone to do anything or to force them to give up control over their own body. That sort of simplistic "solution" would require BIG government on the scale never before seen.
"...the government has the right to impose the punishment...
BIG GOVERNMENT! BIG GOVERNMENT! BIG GOVERNMENT! BIG GOVERNMENT!
Outlawing abortion would not require big government. Otherwise, Roe v. Wade would have reduced the size of government, which it didn't. Your argument holds no water whatsoever.
Can someone answer my question. Why can senator obama say it's OK to abort a "viable" (according to Roe vs Wade) baby?
Nice try John.
I agree we shouldn't allow people to kill babies.
I also believe that if the fetus is viable it should not be killed unless it is a medical necessity.
But there is a difference between a fertilized egg and a baby. And women are better equipped to make those decisions than the government.
I'll answer your question, Zion. Because he is the Messiah and his word is infallible.
Keith Olberman told me so.
Obama didn't say it was OK to abort a viable anything.
He voted against a fundamentally flawed law. Doesn't mean he is for abortion, he's just against bad laws.
We must be giving out those get out of jail free cards all the time to jilted girlfriends, Israel, you just said the girl that was raped WOULD get off if she tracked him down and killed him in his sleep. How do those two sentences make sense???
I doubt the scenario that John describes has ever happened. It's a silly hypothetical to prove a ridiculous nonexistent point.
The law allows for mitigating circumstances in cases of temporary insanity and that's what I would argue. If you have a good lawyer you can get away with stuff (evben killing people) sometimes.
Yes, there is a difference between a fertilized egg and a baby. Just like there is a difference between a newborn and a teenager. A newborn cannot survive on its own without the help of its mother. A teenager, however, can. So does that mean we can take the life of the newborn because it can't survive on its own? No, of course not. That would be ridiculous. In fact, the newborn requires EXTRA protection because it is so vulnerable. And that is why a fetus deserves just as much, if not more, protection.
That is the point exactly. The baby is NOT her own body! What is wrong with you? Dod you see that Ultra sound on this very page? That is not Jeshanah, that is Zion's baby!
And Sharla I said the woman "will probably" get off completely, which you changed to WOULD get off, to make your point.
If you are gonna misquote me, at least don't CAPITALIZE the misquotes
If you have a good lawyer you can get away with stuff?!?!? What a creepy mentality.
Just because you can "get away with stuff" doesn't make it right.
Nope, wrong again John.
A baby can survive without its mother. Anyone else can help take care of it.
A non-viable fetus cannot survive without its mother.
Abortion is insanity. So that defense just might work.
That doesn't change anything. Caps or no caps, your argument doesn't hold up
Yeah sorry to break it to you John. The justice system isn't perfect.
But maybe if you made it really GIANT then it would be perfect, just like the Government, huh?
Israel,
Here is the law
http://www.nrlc.org/federal/Born_Alive_Infants/BAIPLaw0405.html
Now please explain to me where it was flawed.
Also, I should point out that none of the other democrats seemed to have believed it was flawed either. In fact Obama was the one and only senator who voted against it.
That doesn't change anything. Caps or no caps, your argument doesn't hold up
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Without the misquote neither does you point, Sharla.
So, that's where all your anger come from! You're insecure about your small stature!
A baby is considered viable usually around 28 weeks according to wikipedia. It didn't say it couldn't survive without help, just that it could survive. It even points out that even though a baby would need help from machines, it is still considered "viable"
That link doesn't work but I would be happy to analyze laws and statutes for you all day if you would just pay me my hourly rate, which is $250 an hour.
I'll even take a check...
Huh?
I may not be a pituitary case or a freak like John, but I'm plenty tall enough...
My point holds up just as well with the "would probably" as it does with the "would" in uppercase or in lower. You just don't want to have to answer the question, Shorty!
Gotta go watch the rest of the Cal football game. last I checked they were beating WSU 58 to 3.
TIVO rules!!
Israel, here is the law in its entirety.
Public Law 107-207
U.S. Code
Title 1, Chapter 1: Rules of Construction
Section 8.
''Person'', ''human being'', ''child'', and ''individual'' as including born-alive infant
(a) In determining the meaning of any Act of Congress, or of any ruling, regulation, or interpretation of the various administrative bureaus and agencies of the United States, the words ''person'', ''human being'', ''child'', and ''individual'', shall include every infant member of the species homo sapiens who is born alive at any stage of development.
(b) As used in this section, the term ''born alive'', with respect to a member of the species homo sapiens, means the complete expulsion or extraction from his or her mother of that member, at any stage of development, who after such expulsion or extraction breathes or has a beating heart, pulsation of the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary muscles, regardless of whether the umbilical cord has been cut, and regardless of whether the expulsion or extraction occurs as a result of natural or induced labor, cesarean section, or induced abortion.
(c) Nothing in this section shall be construed to affirm, deny, expand, or contract any legal status or legal right applicable to any member of the species homo sapiens at any point prior to being ''born alive'' as defined in this section.
OK Sharla. I'll concede the point if it makes you happy.
Of course you really had no point to concede, but who cares right?
I'm aware that our justice system isn't perfect. But to start with a baseline that "you can get away with stuff" is not setting the bar very high, IMO. Call me an idealist, but I prefer a justice system that tries to mete out justice over one that lets people get away with stuff.
Very poorly drafted, vague and ambiguous especially this section.
Very pretty words and a nice sentiment but in actuality almost impossible to determine to a legal certitude. Under that definition spontaneous abortions, could be characterized as live births.
(b) As used in this section, the term ''born alive'', with respect to a member of the species homo sapiens, means the complete expulsion or extraction from his or her mother of that member, at any stage of development, who after such expulsion or extraction breathes or has a beating heart, pulsation of the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary muscles, regardless of whether the umbilical cord has been cut, and regardless of whether the expulsion or extraction occurs as a result of natural or induced labor, cesarean section, or induced abortion.
I dunno. You are the one who just said without the misquote, my POINT didn't hold up!
This part is particularly bad:
"definite movement of voluntary muscles"
A quivering mass of protoplasm could be said to be "born alive" under that definition even if (like most Republicans) it lacks brains, a spinal cord and a heart.
Then why did all the democrats vote for it too? It is the law now.
Enjoy your ballgame. :)
'night all...
Hey! Cal beat WSU at Washington State 66-3.
That's almost as bad as I beat you guys in our little debate. ;)
I enjoyed it. It was fun being on teh same side against Snoopy for once.
Zion,
Because they are all extremely smart, have backbones to stand up for what is right and their hearts are in the right place, unlike all the repulicans who voted the same way. I know it makes no sense whatsoever, but that is just because we are too stupid to get the point, if there even is a point, which we can't possibly understand, except sometimes you can because your his brother. ;)
It's not really "a law" Zion.
It's a legal definition and not a very good one. It is to be used when interpreting a law.
Legal definitions often bear no resemblance to anything in real life anyway...
Well thanks for the clarification. ;) (Everyone else is winking so I thought I would too!)
;)
Oh good! Maybe I've got the last word. I've think I've just summed up the whole conversation quite nicely!;)
Obama probably just voted against the law because authorizing such was "above his pay grade."
(That's also probably why he votes "present" 80% of the time)
I've been trying for a while to figure out where all this anger comes from when it comes to our good friend Israel. I thought for a while he was probably performing abortions on the side and then feeling guilty about it. It seems he's always defending the pro choice stance. But I think now I am probably on to something with his smaller stature self image thing.
We all know Mr. H is a mental giant as well as nearly a physical one AT 6'8". PMB is probably at least 6'4". Zion is what...6'2"? Snoopy is pretty tall, I'm not sure about the numbers there, Justin is about 6' and for those of you who don't know Cyndi is real close to that too. Jess is 5'10" I think and Jeshanah is around 5'9" and even I am 5'8".
Israel no doubt realizes he is the smallest person in the room and is greatly affected by that. All of us bigger people must be understanding when he lashes out. ;)
ROFL so hard! Sharla, you might have come up with something!
All of us tall mental giants against one small (minded) thinker... too funny..
However, I don't think Israel is pro-choice because of that. I am still trying to figure it out. He does say that he doesn't think anyone should have an abortion, but yet supports the freedom to choose to have one. I have never been able to see how anyone who has children especially, can support this choice.
I can't believe I take the evening off and you all sound off on abortion. I love to get on my soapbox over abortion and I missed it.
Oh, well - here is my take, better late than not at all...
Read my LIPStick..
In my opinion and faith, life begins at the the moment of conception, which can take up to 48hours for the sperm and egg to unite.
I don't believe that abortion is an option in ANY situation, hard as that may be when faced with incest, rape, or a mother's life at stake.
When there is an unnatural reason for the pregnancy, such as incest or rape - there is hate, anger, fear. Perhaps the act of forgiving the perpetrator will come in the form of loving the baby.
Babies have that way of touching the most wounded heart, even those who have been wounded by rape or incest. Adoption is always an option if a mother feels she can not keep the child.
In the case of consentual sex - that is pro-choice to me. Two legally adult people choosing to have sex is their choice. If the consequences of that choice is a pregnancy - then all options for choice go away, because the baby should have the option to choose to live.
Females need to really, really consider their choices in choosing to have sex because men can walk away. The female has to make the choice to have the child or to kill it.
There are six views of when life begins according to the "experts" now.
Genetic View - at conception
Embyrological View - 14 days
Neurological View - 6 - 24 weeks
Ecological View - 25 to 27 weeks
Birth View 7 to 9 months
Awareness View
There is a sixth view of life promoted by some philosophers. They believe that neither a fetus nor an infant is a human being because it does not possess a consciousness of itself. In the article "Abortion and Infanticide," Michael Tooley argues that abortion and infanticide are both acceptable because life does not begin until the human child gains self-awareness. This generally occurs around 18 months after birth.
COME ON - I know some full-grown adults who are not self-aware. Should we kill them???
See how stupid it gets?? We can keep extending the age of self-awareness and just kill off anyone who someone doesn't believe that their life matters yet.
I'm not an angry person, but what little anger I do have I chose to direct at the mental midgets in Ohio who are responsible for electing Bush twice and still haven't learned from their mistakes.
Do you have any idea how hard it is to tower* over the rest of you intellectually? (Of course you don't...)
My whole life I've had to deal with the repercussions of being the smartest. It's tough. You've got no one around to have an interesting conversation with because the vast majority of people either couldn't think their way out of a wet paper bag if their life depended on it.
Take it from me, it can be lonely at the top .0001 percent of the intelligence bell curve.
However, I find that the mentally limited can be a good source of amusement if you just sit back and laugh at their little theories. Sometimes it's fun to see them struggling to understand you (Good Luck!) or trying to wrap their little brains around basic concepts like "the separation of church and state" or the concept of "limited government" or the concept of a "right to privacy."
Sometimes the hilarity comes from the fact that the best they can come up with is stuff like "He's angry cuz he's short." (Not that it matters but I'm about a half inch over 5-9 BTW, and have never considered myself short at all. My wife is a half inch over 5-1 which is perfect for me and I would hate to be as tall as John thus forcing her to stare at my belly button all day.)
Also Jeshanah keeps talking about "fish" and I think this is somehow supposed to cut me to the quick, but I have no idea why I'm supposed to be insulted by "fish." Please explain...
*actually I have a confession to make, it's not hard at all. ;)
zion said...
Israel's stance on abortions isn't as liberal as Obama. He thinks the only time that an abortion should happen is when the baby comes about by no choice of the mother, or if the life of the mother is at stake. I can see why he would feel that way.
However, I believe that when two consenting adults have sex and get pregnant, and the baby poses no threat, there is absolutely NO time when the baby should be aborted. To abort the baby is totally wrong 100% of the time, no matter what the situation.
The only reason that someone would abort a healthy baby is so they don't have to live with the consquences of their actions. And I would challenge anyone to tell me of a sitation where it would be ok to abort a healthy child conceived by two consenting adults.
I don't believe in killing the handicap, like Hitler, so I don't think that's a valid case either.
So I don't see why people need to have a choice, when there is a only one correct choice.
The only other case might be where they feel the baby is going to suffer a terrible life or be born in a vegatative state similar to Terri Schiavo's, which I believe was terribly mishandled. I still feel the same way.
But I still think that life should be protected 100% of the time.
FISH STINK!
The fish thing is because earlier my mom was baiting you to come on this post and say something... and it was such obvious baiting to the rest of us, and you (like a little fish) fell for it, came on here, started ranting, and we've all been having a great time ever since! That comment came when we only had like 10 comments, and now we're at close to 500! I'd have to say that you like worms and all her baiting worked!!
We like to mock your obviously superior intellect almost as much as you like to tease us for being dumb. It's lots of fun! =)
Yeah, I think the bait was taken!!
I truly empathize with Israel - it has to be awful, being the intellectual tower that he is and having to play in the slow lane with all of the little mental midgets from Ohio!
But inquiring minds have to ask??
How did you get to be so smart? Was it a God-given ability?? Or what?
Yeah, I've definitely hit the ol' nail on the head. He proudly proclaims to be 5'9 1/2" tall putting himself just over Jeshanah and myself, obviously and happily admittedly the least brainy of the bunch! I'm sure I can speak for Shan when I say we decided long ago that looks are of much more value in the world! Hmph!< tossing my hair > But then he uses the word "tower" about himself. Yea, I've got him figured out! :)
Lol about your fish stink! comment,Shan. I bet THAT cut him to the quick!
I was thinking that it IS so much more fun to play when Israel plays with us, and then I thought about the fact that I said earlier that he doesn't play well with others and wondered why I thought that it is still more fun.
It reminded me of first grade recess when Dennis the fat kid would come out and chase the girls. Everybody hated Dennis the fat kid and I was completely terrified of him. He was supposed to be a second grader but he'd been held back which made him even more huge! Now I always loved the game of boys chase girls, and when Paul caught me I thought I'd died and gone to heaven. But on those occasional days when Dennis the fat kid would play, it added a whole new dimension to the game, granted it was one of abject terror, but exciting none the less.
I figure it is something like that. :)
I hate to burst any bubbles.... but I'm actually right at 5'10".
(sorry) :)
Poor Israel.
Side bar to Sharla----
I know who Dennis the fat kid is, but I am still trying to figure out heavenly Paul?????
I forgot to mention earlier...
Today's Special!!!!
My services in Early Childhood Development Consulting are much sought after, and normally in very high demand - sometimes, why people even want to pay me $500 per hour. I always refuse that much, of course, because I am a humble woman by nature!!!
But I believe that we should also be a service to people who need us. So today, I will offer my services for free!
If I can convince just one person that life begins at conception and there is NO CHOICE, not PRO CHOICE, it will be worth it!!
In first grade, I was all about Paul Oswalt. I know, nobody thought he was that great by say, fourth or fifth grade, but in first he was first! He had those sparkly crinkly eyes!
I thought it might be him, but then again - you might have been talking about Paul Jessup! LOL!
Paul Jessup was just a baby kindergartener then! No way!
I saw paul jessup and Rob at my aunt Polly's funeral a year? or so ago. It was great seeing them. Rob was always a clunky fat kid who tried to make kids think he was mean, I always saw through that, he was a sweetie. The main thing I remember about Paul was it seemed like his face was always dirty! Lol. They both turned out great. I was proud of them when I saw them again after all these years.
This is a horrible question, but is Dennis even still alive? I know he had horrible health problems due to his weight even in his twenties, did I hear that he died? It is terrible that I can't even remember that. I really am getting old.
Yes, he passed away about 2 years ago. He kept getting worse, than he would rally and get better. Finally after three kidney transplants and years of dialysis his body couldn't take it anymore.
Wow!! Sharla Mocking a dead fat dude.
That's gotta be whole new low...
Oh, I wasn't fished in, it was total coincidental that I happened to read this post and I don't need Sharla's encouragement, cuz I'm always more than happy to trash the Republican morons du jour on this site.
And yeah, this blog is always horribly boring when I'm not on it. You guys should be thanking me for gracing you with my presence.
I feel really bad about havi8ng been scared of Dennis, and I am very sorry for the sad life he lived and his early demise. I was however friends with him after first grade and never treated him in any manner I am ashamed of.
And obviously we ARE thanking you for your presense and freely admitting that it is always more fun when you join us!
If anyone, as in any newcomers such as Snoopy or Cyndi, think we are anything other that what we are, extended family that loves each other very much and loves to argue amongst ourselves, as well as Brothers and Sisters in Christ, they have the wrong idea. We have been driving each other nuts for quite a while now and find it very entertaining!
I don't know about the rest of you, but I haven't had this many side splitting laughs since the last time Israel played with us on the blog. It was even more fun having Cyndi and Snoopy join in on the fun. Almost everything I say is tongue and cheek, (not my convictions of course) but definitely all my insults, slams and baitings. Israel knows this, I just want to make sure everyone else does. ;) I love you all. :)
I think you're all annoying and I mean anything I say that's the least insulting 100%! =P
Especially in regards to Israel! So there! =P again!
(sorry, I'm just trying to get us to 500 so I'm not such a blog loser...)
Shan, seriously? Anything less than five hundred comments is a loser blog? Is that right? I have been on very few blogs, yours and johns and what's his name's from toledo. Do other blogs out there often have over 500 comments? Or are you just wanting to get there and it is unusual?
We do miss you Israel, when you don't grace us with your words of wisdom! We all just about die of niceness!
And I am not exactly a newcomer to half of the group!!! You all do love each other...
Let's hope I don't turn my brothers loose on the blog - Israel will be begging for mercy. And it wouldn't be fair - so many "TALL" people picking on one dude all by himself.
lol Cyndi. :)
Do Mark, Paul and Danny blog? Bring 'em in! Israel can take it! After all, they are just what, Factory workers, farmers and teachers from Ohio and Indiana, right? How smart could they be??
Also, I really hope ol' Snoopy comes back. I hope we haven't scared him off completely.
To Israel:
Maybe you've already answered this, but how can you believe in small government and support Obama? Have you read all of his proposals? There is easily a couple hundred billion dollars in new programs and policies proposed on his website.
Hey Snoop!
I agree, especially about erring on the side of caution. Actually I have had this discussion with Israel, and I think the only reason he even remotely sounds like he wants to support abortion for any reason is the quickening thing. Something about what Brother Branham said, and it has made me wonder too. I know B.B. said something like watch a woman when she is about to give birth, and even if she is normally mean, about then she will get real sweet, when that new life is about to come into the world, and then something about the "quickening". It is kinda confusing, and if we were out in California without each other so close like we have it here, we might be leaning the same way Israel does on that issue because of that statement by Brother Branham. Do you guys know what quote I am even talking about? Is there more than one place he says that?
Boy, bet Zion can't wait for that to happen to me. haha
Actually, on Babycenter.com, they call when you first start to feel the baby move (usually <16-20> weeks) the "quickening". I don't know if there's any connection, but I thought it was interesting when I read that a few weeks ago.
and Mom, my blog rocks, but every time we get to the next hundred, I wanna go for the next one! (Kinda like that awesome Pampered Chef party I had all those years ago...) =)
Here's a beautifully ironic fact that I learned during my trip to Israel.
The Philistines, along with their Canaanite brethren, were known FOR SACRIFICING THEIR CHILDREN TO THEIR PAGAN GODS.
In other words, a probable reason for why God made an exception to "thou shalt not kill" in the case of sending the Israelites to massacre certain of their Canaanite neighbors is that they were murdering their own children.
It's simple. First, if a baby is alive after it leaves its mother's womb, and since nothing happens in the process of birth that contributes to the definition of "living," then the baby is alive BEFORE it leaves the womb. If it is alive before it leaves the womb and there is no definite point during its development at which the baby becomes so, then one must err on the side of caution and assume that it was alive from the time it became a unique genetic entity.
As we all know, killing a living human being simply because it's inconvenient is murder. Therefore, abortion is murder. If the government should legislate and enforce murder laws, then it should also legislate and enforce anti-abortion laws, regardless of whatever difficulties may arise.
Yea, Snoopy, we read that the first time. And I agree. But, Brother Branham did say something about like the breath of life, the quickening, something like that, something special that happens like when an angel comes to the baby or the theophany or something right at the birth. Do you know anything about that? Because that is where the difficulty lies.
I had to delete the first version of the comment for grammatical reasons.
The thing is, Bro. Branham didn't say much, if anything, about abortion, mostly because back then people weren't stupid enough to think that abortion was justifiable. I'm not familiar with the quote(s) you're referring to.
Brother Branham used the word quickening often, usually referring to raising the dead, or quickening of the Spirit.
I know what you are referring to - and I think it was the breath of life when a baby is born.
WOW! I was number 500!!! I feel like I won the Indy 500...
No, Mark, Paul and Dan don't blog that I know of, but they all have VERY definite opinions on politics.
Dan, having taught History for many years is a walking encyclopedia on political parties and current events. He is very conservative.
And you know Paul has a mouth that doesn't stop, when you turn him loose and get him going.
Daniel, hey, I din't mean to be rude with you there about deleting your post, and then posting it again. Sorry. I just thought that you thought we hadn't seen it.
Well, the way I understand it, is that is why Israel thinks it my not really like have a sould or something untill that time, which seems to be at birth. I wish Zion or someone could find the quote, or Israel was paying attention and defending his position rationally himself!
Well, Zion is looking for his version of the message to re-install on his computer. (Someone accidentally spilled water all over his laptop a while ago and he hasn't gotten everything he used to have back on it yet... it's a touchy subject, try not to get him started.) The good news is, now, no matter how upset he gets with me I can just come back with, I AM CARRYING YOUR CHILD! and he has to calm down. hehe It's great.
wow, that was just one typo after another. I better wake up or give up and go to bed! I meant didn't and might not have a soul hopefully you can figure the rest of what I was trying to say out.
I bet it would be tons of fun to have your brothers on here Cyndi! Tell themn about it in case they wanna try it!
Oh, you weren't being rude, Sharla, I just wanted to clarify why I posted the same thing twice. You're the last person on this blog who should be apologizing for rudeness.
I firmly believe that anyone well versed in history cannot possibly maintain a liberal world view. Your son Dan sounds like an interesting guy. I've thought about teaching history. Something to do when I retire from being the Emperor of the World.
I wish Danny Ramirez, Zion's brother who does some preaching at the Phoenix church and the only brother I have never met, would come on here and talk with all of us.
It's her brother.
Right. Your brother Daniel sounds like an interesting guy. :)
Snoopy, are you gonna be Emperor of the World or are you already Emperor of the World? Cause if you are it now, maybe you should consider early retirement. I'm just saying..
Sharla, I found it in Questions and Answers.
1155-54 Now, when a little baby is being formed under the mother's heart... And you little children that understand these things (See?), the Lord gave you to mother. And she carried you under her heart, because you're close to her heart. And then, one day the Lord came down and delivered you from mother's heart, from away from her heart, but you'll always be in her heart.
Now, while this little body is being formed, little natural body being formed in the mother, there is a spiritual body of the earth ready to receive this natural body as soon as it is born. Now, the baby is borned with live muscles, a beating heart, but no breath of life in it. It's muscles twitching. See? Then, see, if there was something different from that, if there wasn't a spirit that had to come into it later, then our breath could leave us, and we would breathe no more and still be alive. But when this body doesn't receive oxygen from the--or breath (intake and out-take of our lungs), then we're dead.
1156-56 Now, but when the mother... The little baby is dropped to the earth from the mother's heart ("dropped," you understand what I'm saying, what way I'm--the reason I'm saying it this way), when the little baby is dropped, what happens? As soon as it comes forth, if it doesn't start crying, the doctor, midwife, or whatever, will spank it [Brother Branham claps his hands--Ed.], stretch it. It's got to have a shock, and what happens?
Notice, a mother, she can be ever so mean and cruel, but just before that baby's born, there's a certain kindness that sets in. Did you ever notice a mother when she's to be mother? There's something sweet about her; she always takes on that sweetness. It's because that--that little angel, little spirit, a little messenger to this little tabernacle is ready to come forth into the world. And then, when this little angel comes into the body (That's a little angel of the earth, a spirit that's ordained of God to take this body.), then that baby has to have a choice. It makes its decision. Then when this takes place, then you see the Angel of the Lord now comes in here which is a spiritual body, that eternal.
1156-58 This is a dying spirit in a dying body; but now, you can't be in two bodies at one time, but there can be two natures in you at one time. Now, the nature of the Spirit of the Lord... When you're borned again, you're not borned of physical, like the baby was; but what's happened, the spiritual birth has come to you. And while this spiritual birth is growing into your heart, of God, there is a physical or a celestial body growing to receive that spirit. And when the life leaves this body, it goes to that body. Just as when the body is presented to the earth, the spirit comes in, and when the spirit goes out of the body, there is a body waiting. "For we know that after this earthly tabernacle be dissolved, we have one already waiting." See? That's it, the spiritual body of the people.
Brother Branham...
I say, "I'm just saying..." and things like "...Really?" as often as I can on here because that is stuff Glenn Beck says all the time and Israel can't stand Glenn Beck so I am assuming it really gets under his skin! ;)
Glenn Beck is brilliant. He was ahead of the Sarah Palin curve by about a month. Too bad Israel doesn't like him. He could learn a lot from Glenn.
Daniel, by the way - I am pleased to meet you! We got so carried away yesterday, that I didn't respond.
Yes, my brother Dan is very interesting. He is an Athletic Director now at Northwestern in Kokomo, IN. So between sports and history, he always has much to discuss.
Everyone in our family is very strong-willed and opinionated, so family gatherings have a lot of hot air flowing!
well, I didn't mean to place that right after that, oh well, you know you can't control these things. What do you guys think about that quote?
I love Glenn Beck. I only wish he weren't so casual with the name of our Lord so often or actually ever. I am sure he doesn't understand, but I have to shut him off when he says things just to be funny sometimes. I agree with most of what he says most of the time. I prefer him to Rush, although sometimes a like him pretty well, too. Sean is annoying as most democrats in my book! I think Alan Colmes comes across better just because he is more polite! Keith Oberman makes me crazy. Sometimes I watch CNN and MSNBC just so I can try to understand Israe! lol ;)
I believe that he is saying that we don't receive our angel until we breathe air. Because he says that we can't receive it (the angel) before we breathe air, because otherwise we would still be alive even if we stopped breathing. Does that make sense?
I have always thought that we have a soul upon conception, but that our spiritual angel comes when we are born. And when we die, the spiritual angel goes to a celestial body.
Here is one reference that Bro. Branham makes to abortion.
E-23 Now, I might ask you this a way, want you to consider this. In the 10th chapter of Hebrews, about the 40th verse, somewhere there, I want to ask you, if you ever did think, or hear people speak on, what the unpardonable sin was. I used to be told by my mother that the unpardonable sin was a abortion case. In other words, a woman that would get rid of her babies before they were born, taking the life of the children before they even had a chance, that that was the unpardonable sin.
But that... I believed that for years, because I was told that by my mother. She only took it by... She was not a Christian at the time, and so she just took it for granted that that's what it was; it was doing that. Others said it was committing murder: A man that murdered could not be forgiven for it. After reading the Bible for myself, I find out that taking human life is forgiven.
E-24 Now, remember, lady, that's a horrible thing.
Here not long ago a woman come to my house; she said, "Reverend Branham, I'm going crazy."
I said, "What's the matter?" She told me of the little babies lives that she had took of her own before that they were born, or even matured, time for delivered. And she said, "I... Every time I get to myself," said, "I can hear babies crying in my ears." And she said, "Every time I set down to write a letter or something, I can feel little cold hands running through my hair."
"As you sow, so shall you reap." Remember that. Live right; live upright. Confess your wrongs before God, then get out of that way and walk like men and women, servants of God ought to walk and live.
But still, that is not the unpardonable sin.
E-25 Jesus said, when He was here on earth... They brought to Him one day a bunch of men, and they said, "He casteth out devils through Beelzebub, the prince of the devils."
And Jesus said, "You can speak a word against the Son of man; it will be forgiven you. But whosoever speaketh a word against the Holy Ghost will not be forgiven him in this world or the world to come." Whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost... For they were calling... See, the atonement, the blood cell, as I'll get to after a bit, was not bursted yet, so it could be forgiven then. The Holy Spirit had not pierced Itself from this blood cell. But after once coming from there, it's the unpardonable.
That sounds like the theophany to me. But, correct me if I'm wrong, only people who are on the Lamb's book of life have a theophany? Every person has a soul, unlike animals, who do have spirits? Like I know they have their own personality. Each animal does. I have heard countless sermons on this stuff, but probably more than anyone else I know, I leak! The Word has to have the answer to this, as to when the baby is not just a bunch of cells, I bet Zion could answer this about what all this means where Brother Branham said this, I hope he can. I know he is busy with school work tonight.
This takes a bit so bear with me...
We all agree that abortion is wrong. Some, like Zion, believe there are specific cases where it would be acceptable (e.g. saving the life of the mother). I happen to agree. Still, we all agree it's a despicable act.
The rub is in how or if that moral should be codified in law. Is it on the level of murder?
(from Levitical law)
Ex 21:
22 If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine.
23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
This is a sticky wicket, and people on both sides of the abortion debate try to superficially twist it to mean what they want.
I've studied multiple translations and commentaries on this (for what it's worth). The general consensus on the original Hebrew is that "fruit depart from her" means a premature birth after which the baby survives, not miscarriage.
If the baby was born premature and it or the mother died as a result (mischief followed), the punishment was death.
Now, that's Levitical law. Yes, I realize we don't follow the letter of that system due to the New Testament (e.g. stoning for adultery), and even modern Jews do not hold to this penal code for their own reasons. But we can glean principles from it.
Here's the principle: it appears that Exodus 21 considers the death of a child resulting from an intentional wound while in the womb to be a form of murder.
Back to codification...
Do you think a potential mother should be subjected to a murder charge for aborting her baby? If convicted in Texas, that means lethal injection.
There is a logical contradiction if you believe in the death penalty for murder, hold to Judeo-Christian principles from Leviticus, yet don't think abortion doctors should be executed.
For myself, the issue of abortion caused me to re-think my stance on the death penalty, for which I was formerly in favor.
So should there be ANY punishment at all for abortion? I have an inherent aversion to legislating morality, but if I believe that abortion is a form of murder, I must also believe that societies' punishment for murder should apply on some level to this act. To think otherwise is logically inconsistent.
At a minimum, holding to these principles means I can not vote for a government or president that uses tax dollars to support, promote, and provide abortion operations! I don't want that on my record.
We hear the words "limited government" thrown around a lot, and are then accused of wanting to force our morality on everyone else. I would be thrilled if our government WAS so limited on this. There is nothing limited about the government's current stance on abortion. It supports it!!
"Let's not play games. What I was suggesting -- you're absolutely right that John McCain has not talked about my Muslim faith."
Barack Obama, Sept 7, 2008 on ABC
LOL!!! Yea, it's a bit out of context, but wow! The dude is a total dunce when he's away from his teleprompter. What was that thing Israel said? Trained monkey?
Well, PMB, now you've done it! Now you have just proved yourself to be a racist! Don't you know the rules for all us typical white people?? You can NOT even remotely associate the word "monkey" with a black man or even a half black man! Unless sometimes I guess if the black man were some freak of nature who espoused republican ideas, I think it's usually fine then. But to even hint at the "m" word relating to the revered BHO is NOT to be done! For Shame!! Now you can call a Christian mother of 5 a monkey all day long, that is all in good fun and perfectly acceptable. ;)
Oops, gotta run! Glenn Beck starts in 2 minutes!
Irony: it's what's for dinner.
Bananas, and watermelons, and monkeys, Oh MY!
I've gotten a dozen death threats from the NAACP and Al Sharpton's 150lb alter ego just this weekend.
Cyndi, about your quote from Brother Branham concerning abortion, sounds to me like he was agin it. :)
lol PMB
Asked on Sunday whether the "above my pay grade" answer was too flip, Obama said: "Probably. ...What I intended to say is that, as a Christian, I have a lot of humility about understanding when does the soul enter into ... It's a pretty tough question."
Funny. What does "pay grade" have to do with your beliefs? His initial excuse for not having an answer on a KEY topic was due to medical and physiological complexity. Now, it's critical for him to throw in Christian jargon, ya know, to show how Christian he is - not Muslim. And, did you notice how humble he is too?!
Poser.
Well, PMB, I don't agree with Obama on anything, but to be fair, I think what he was trying to say is that only God, in other words, only Someone at God's pay grade, would know when the soul enters the body and the cells actually become a person.
Everyone knows the babies are alive long before birth, so the only possible excuse they have for it being okay to kill it is to say it is the mother's body, just some tissue, more like a plant than a baby. It is quite a reach, but then, it is all they have.
No one wants to admit they have been responsible for murdering millions of people. But plants, not such a big problem for the conciensce.
How could it possibly be above the Chosen One's pay grade? If he can roll back the waters and heal the planet...
Yea, that's probably what he "meant." But since when did we start giving lizar...err...politicians the benefit of the doubt? :-)
It is sad really. They can't even allow the baby to be an animal, because all the left wants to PROTECT animals. Sin gets people tied up in such knots.
Ok I have a question...
When a pregnant woman if killed in a car crash by a druken driver or even shot and you hear about it, the culprit is always guilty of a double murder.
How is that a murder and abortion just a choice?
I know I am the only one on here who would ever be dumb enough to do that, give a politician the benefit of the doubt, but when you don't have a reputation as a great debater or a powerful intellect at stake, you can say anything you want. I find my own sarcasms extremely funny and since I blog for my own entertainment I just go ahead and have fun, let the chips fall where they may. I don't care if others laugh with me or at me or just think I am a complete moron, I am having a ball! I also think all you smart people are extremely entertaining as well as informative and all of your ( all you brainy people) jokes are so witty, they crack me up.
But I did watch Obama's speech, and I feel like he's a likable human being, too. He is probably well intentioned and wants his daughters to grow up in a great America. I actually wish he was much more conservative in his thinking because I think it would be cool to have a black president, they have all looked alike for 200 years. But I would never consider voting for anyone who appears to me to have such incredibly poor judgement. His church alone rules him out for me.
Good question, Becca! If Israel ever tries to answer that one he won't be able to in a ratioanl way, so watch out, you're gonna get insulted! :)
Hey, I just got a copy of my first ever commercial! It's great, starring Janessa and Rapp! Becca, can you take over my computer and get it and then Shan can post it on here for everyone to see??
Ben's having his mid-morning snack right now, but she'll do that as soon as he's done. =)
Sharla,
I am just getting ready to head your way...running a little behind schedule (what else is new?)
See ya soon.
Yeah! Cyndi is coming up to spend the rest of the day ( and no doubt most of the night) with me!! YEAH!!
I notice that Israel hasn't been commenting a whole lot (if at all) since last night. Wonder why that might be... ;)
To Israel:
There's a really entertaining website which you would probably find interesting called debate.com. Basically you create a profile and challenge other people to debates based on their stances on issues (which is contained in their profile.) You take turns making arguments, after which other users vote on who won the debate. The only problem is that name-calling doesn't score any points, so you might have trouble...
The problem with that site of course would be that all the judges are morons!
Snoopy,
It's possible Israel isn't on here today because he's a busy, highly compensated lawyer, and has better things to do than hang out with morons like us.
Sharla,
I've been on debate.com. The judges are mostly morons. :-)
When I said I was scared of Dennis the fat kid in first grade, and then remembered that Dennis had died, that is when this blog hit a new low. Now, you see it has reached the point of being completely beneath our
es-"steamed" friend. (get it? get it? cough..anger..) And no amount of my ridiculous baiting will entice him! Hhmmph!
Luke 1: 41-44
41And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost:
42And she spake out with a loud voice, and said, Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb.
43And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
44For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.
Seems to me that if a babe in the womb is capable of receiving revelation, then it ought to have some sort of protection in terms of its life.
Excellent excellent point, Mr. H
I considered the possibility that Israel has a life, but decided not to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Yes, many of the people on debate.com are morons, but I wouldn't say most. It's split pretty much down the middle. There are those who vote for who they agree with, regardless of the quality of that person's arguments, but they are fairly evenly dispersed among ideologies, so it all evens out in the end.
Hey guys I don't have a lot of time to hang out today but I saw this and it started to dawn on me why people in Ohio need so many laws on the books to tell them what to do about every little thing.
The Ohio Legislature should probably pass a law against microwaving babies, since folks from Ohio seem to be crying out for guidance on this issue.
Just for the record, I am against microwaving (or cooking) babies in any way.
---------
Ohio Woman Microwaves her Baby to Death
DAYTON, Ohio - A woman was sentenced Monday to life in prison without the chance for parole for burning her baby daughter to death in a microwave after fighting with her boyfriend.
Well my stomach just did an unusual flip. That's so sick.
Hmm... but just think, if she had done something like that before the baby was born, instead of going to jail she could have received government assistance. Now that's sick.
"Honorable" Democratic congressman investigated for ethics violations
New York Times
Representative Charles B. Rangel paid no interest for more than a decade on a mortgage extended to him to buy a villa at a beachfront resort in the Dominican Republic, according to Mr. Rangel’s lawyer and records from the resort.
The loan was given to him by the resort development company, in which Theodore Kheel, a prominent New York labor lawyer, was a principal investor. Mr. Kheel, who has given tens of thousands of dollars to Mr. Rangel’s campaigns over the past decade, had encouraged the congressman to be one of the initial investors in the project.
The loan, which was extended to Mr. Rangel in 1988, was originally to be paid back over seven years at a rate of 10.5 percent. But within two years, interest on the loan was waived for Mr. Rangel and six other early investors because the resort was generating less income than projected, according to a statement released on Friday by Jose Oliva, director of the resort.
The loan remained interest-free and Mr. Rangel eventually paid it off in 2003.
As details about the financing of the villa emerged on Friday, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, through her spokesman, expressed support for an ethics investigation into Mr. Rangel’s failure to report rental income from the vacation home on his federal and state income taxes and financial disclosure forms. On Friday, The New York Times reported that Mr. Rangel, chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, had earned more than $75,000 in rent on the vacation home since 1988, and according to his lawyers probably owed back taxes to New York State and New York City.
Mr. Rangel’s lawyer, Lanny Davis, said that the congressman’s accountant believed that Mr. Rangel would not owe federal taxes on the unreported income because the income would be offset by a deduction for depreciation and a credit for the taxes the resort owner paid to the Dominican government on the rental income.
It's a good thing those Democrats are so much more principled ethically than those wascally Wepublicans.
Every good liberal knows that if you're going to barbarously murder a baby, you need to do it before it is born.
It's all about the timing -- 8 months and 29 days = good; 9 months = bad.
Israel said: The Ohio Legislature should probably pass a law against microwaving babies...
Well, this may come as a surprise to him, but, we actually have a few of them.
ORC 2903.01 Aggravated murder.
(A) No person shall purposely, and with prior calculation and design, cause the death of another or the unlawful termination of another’s pregnancy.
...
(F) Whoever violates this section is guilty of aggravated murder, and shall be punished as provided in section 2929.02 of the Revised Code.
________________
ORC 2903.02 Murder.
(A) No person shall purposely cause the death of another or the unlawful termination of another’s pregnancy.
...
(D) Whoever violates this section is guilty of murder, and shall be punished as provided in section 2929.02 of the Revised Code.
________________
ORC 2903.03 Voluntary manslaughter.
(A) No person, while under the influence of sudden passion or in a sudden fit of rage, either of which is brought on by serious provocation occasioned by the victim that is reasonably sufficient to incite the person into using deadly force, shall knowingly cause the death of another or the unlawful termination of another’s pregnancy.
(B) Whoever violates this section is guilty of voluntary manslaughter, a felony of the first degree.
________________
But we should probably pull those off the books because they make our government too big. We can't have the government telling people what to do.
By the way... Dayton, where that story took place, is a HUGELY liberal city.
Hey Israel i have a suggestion since your so busy and Ohio choses who is going to be president anyway just tell everyone in california not to bother going out and voting as it would be a total waste of all of your precious energy and that would be far better for the environment thanks.
Justin a proud voter in Ohio
Big Government Ohioans are also in need of a law against bathing in restaurant sinks...
"Ohio Burger King worker fired for bathing in sink
Wed Aug 13, 12:20 AM ET
XENIA, Ohio - Burger King Corp. said Tuesday it had parted ways with an employee who was recorded taking a soapy bath in a utility sink in one of its restaurants in a video that ended up on his MySpace page.
The nearly four-minute video, which was posted online Thursday, shows the man taking the bath to celebrate his birthday. In the video, shot by another worker, the employee refers to himself only as "Mr. Unstable" and appears to be naked.
Timothy Tackett, 25, told WDTN-TV in Dayton that he is the sink-bather and that he made the video for his MySpace page. The video had been removed by Tuesday night."
------------
Look the bottom line is Ohio is a heavily Republican state full of inbred morons put George Bush in office twice.
I've posted dozens and dozens of articles over the past few years definitely proving that Ohio is a state of the Morons and for the Morons. Just check out John's defunct blog if you don't believe me.
When you guys aren't getting fired from Burger King, you're microwaving babies. You've obviously got problems.
And your Republican politicians are so corrupt and deviant that they don't have time to pass all the laws necessary to force you guys to act like civilized human beings.
Acknowledging you have a problem is the first step Ohio...
Meanwhile here are the laws the Geniuses in the Ohio Legislature did see fit to pass.
--------
In Oxford, Ohio, it’s illegal for a woman to strip off her clothing while standing in front of a man’s picture.
As is the case in Indiana, it is a felony for a skating instructor to seduce a female student. A wild guess as to how this one started might be that a lawmaker’s wife or daughter ran off with her skating teacher, right?
Women aren’t allowed to wear patent-leather shoes in Cleveland because a man might see the reflection of something “he oughtn’t!”
In Dayton only men can be hired as hotel bellhops.
-------
Why did Obama even go to Ohio?
Cleveland Plain Dealer:
Obama unfazed by heckler
Posted by Tom Benning August 05, 2008 17:22PM
Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama came to Baldwin-Wallace College in Berea Tuesday afternoon to talk about his energy policies, as he had earlier in the day in Youngstown.
But before he could delve into the topic, a man in the press photo gallery interrupted him, shouting complaints that the Illinois senator had not started the program with the Pledge of Allegiance. Many in the packed gymnasium murmured and some booed the disruption, but Obama took the heckler in stride and asked him to lead the pledge.
The crowd rose to its feet, Obama placed his hand over his heart and everyone recited the pledge. Obama thanked the man, who was not removed by campaign staff, and returned to his speech.
Once again, Obama displays grace. Unlike John McCain, who likes to remove black reporters from his events because…well, they haven’t come up with an answer for why they removed him.
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In defense of Ohioans, you guys are very good at drunk driving...
More Ohio Fun!!
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Woman Accused Of Being Drunk, Letting Toddler Drive
GOSHEN TOWNSHIP, Ohio -- While a designated driver is a good idea if you've been drinking, Goshen Township police said one woman's driver was a bit too young.
An officer said he pulled over Marya Green at the intersection of Buddy Lane and Park Avenue at the Green Acres Mobile Home Park on June 3.
The officer said that when he came to the driver's window, he found that Green's 1-year-old son was at the wheel, sitting in Green's lap.
Green, 29, registered a .11 percent blood-alcohol level. Two other children, ages 8 and 5, were also in the car.
Green was arrested and faces charges of DUI, driving under OVI suspension, noncompliance, and endangering children.
Police said this is Green's third DUI arrest in six years.
The children were released to their father, police said.
Apparently people in Arizona have nothing better to do than read Ohio's news...
For the record, though, I'm a Nebraskan by birth.
I don't read the Ohio news. But whenever Ohio makes the national news it is invariably for:
1) People from Ohio doing something incredibly stupid.
2) Republican Political corruption and hypocrisy.
3) Microwaving babies
Sadly that's pretty much it...
*rolles eyes*
Well, every time one of those crack-head Hollywood stars does something stupid, California makes the news. Copy-n-pasting those news clips here would be a full time job.
And on the theme of honourable Democrats, let's acknowledge Mark Spitzer, Johnathan Edwards, and Kwame Kilpatrick - fine upstanding examples, all.
Israel keeps blaming Ohio for putting Bush in office twice. But I disagree. I blame the Democrats for failing to give the people a viable option. Al Gore and John Kerry? Are you kidding me? I would have gladly voted for a Democrat if they would have nominated someone more qualified than Bush. Sadly, they didn't.
Everyone, I'm at work today, which means I'm bored, so please continue posting! (Unless it's about microwaving babies, because that makes me sick.) Thanks!!!!
Cyndi stayed at my house untill nearly 4 A.M.! We had so much fun catching up on everything. Mr. H stopped by around 11 to get something for Jess and we all started talking about Israel and the blog. John told Cyndi that in spite of how ornery Israel appears on the blog, he is actually one of the nicest and most caring men he has ever known. He related a personal story which I won't go into here for obvious reasons. Cyndi had already seen through all his bluster and had recognised him as a great guy, (if somewhat short)but John's story just added to her estimation of our loveable fiendish foe!
So the gig is pretty much up, Israel. You may as well throw in the towel and quit pretending to espouse those outrageous angry liberal views, every body knows you're a sweetheart.
Except maybe Shan.
lol
John has a heartwarming personal story about Israel?
Awww no fair. I want one too.
Tell ya what. As a matter of good faith and friendship, I promise to not make fun of Israel's liberal friends and candidates for...oh...the next 3 hours. How's that?
Then we can start a hit reality show: "Everybody Loves Israel." It will really anger the Palestinians who take umbrage at the slightest, unrelated thing to their crusade (e.g. Pepsi) so there's a double bonus. And, supporting Israel (the country) is one key important issue that Israel (the really great liberal guy) and we silly conservative Ohioans all agree on.
Yep, already feeln' the love.
*sings: Give Peace a ChaaAAaaAAaAAance!*
Then we can start a hit reality show: "Everybody Loves Israel." It will really anger the Palestinians who take umbrage at the slightest, unrelated thing to their crusade (e.g. Pepsi) so there's a double bonus.
lol
Better change it to OHIO loves Israel!
Yeah, I have a warm and fuzzy feeling about Israel now! I think he is just a big ole liberal Teddy Bear!
By the way... I am getting too old to go to bed at 5:30 am!!!
Hey Sharla!
Aren't you writing a book about a Teddy Bear? Is he a liberal Democrat or a conservative Republican??
That could be a whole new series!
That's a great idea! (For the next series, of course!) The first series is already in the works... (are they all written yet, MOm?)
Cyndi,
You went to bed a half hour after I wake up!! (Of course, we are in different time zones, but still!) That's a very late bedtime!!! You girls are still crazy!!! Do your eyes feel all gritty this morning?
I'm not, of course, (this being a somewhat public blog) but if I ever were to dream of such a thing, I think I should like to make him a gruff old bear on the outside with a cute little (hee hee) lovelable teddy bear on the inside! That always makes for the most interesting bears! ;)
...sorta like what would happen if a matryoshka doll and a care bear had kids. Nice.
I dunno, Winnie the Pooh was pretty lovable all the way around- and he was never gruff! (That's where Eyore comes in...)
Eyore! Poor old Eyore, my absolute favorite. Now there's a donkey you gotta love. It's been my pet name for your father for years!
This post has had more twists and turns than a roller coaster at Cedar Point!
I'm just sayin'...
Eyore was always my favorite, too... or Piglet, or Tigger, or Rabbit. Awww who am I kidding, I love them all!!!
And soon I'll have a valid reason to start watching them all again!!! Woohoo!! (If that's not a reason to have a kid, I don't know what is!!!) hahaha
Sharla if you are writing some children's books, I know an incredible artist who would be able to illustrate them. (If they are really good.)
I represent an Award-winning Hollywood screenwriter and this artist is working on a project for her right now about a pacifist pitt bull puppy.
She's amazing, she's local and she's a good friend. (She is even voting for McCain.)
Why do you think you watched them the first time?? ;)
My eyes are kinda sandpapery today!
Oh, yes - I love Winnie the Pooh too! And Eyore, well that is one donkey I do love.
Isn't the donkey a symbol for a political party? Perhaps if they used Eyore - everyone would love them!
Here is little bit of history tidbit..
Over the years, the donkey and the elephant have become the accepted symbols of the Democratic and Republican parties. Although the Democrats have never officially adopted the donkey as a party symbol, we have used various donkey designs on publications over the years. The Republicans have actually adopted the elephant as their official symbol and use their design widely.
The Democrats think of the elephant as bungling, stupid, pompous and conservative -- but the Republicans think it is dignified, strong and intelligent.
On the other hand, the Republicans regard the donkey as stubborn, silly and ridiculous -- but the Democrats claim it is humble, homely, smart, courageous and loveable.
I have written a series and yes, I think, IMHO, they're the best thing I've ever read for children! lol
I'd rather talk about any other part of this through email please. I must guard it with my life because it is worth untold millions. :)
lol on the animal symbols Cyndi. What a surprise that the two parties see things differently!
Israel,
I just emailed it to you if you still use the lawcat address.
There Israel goes again, being a softy and offering his friend the illustrator up for mom.... what a heart of gold!!! ;)
Sharla,
BRAG, woman, BRAG! It is OK on the blog to say you are the most wonderful writer of children's books and this is an absolutely exciting series about to be published!
It is GREAT - we need more books like this for children!!
Just don't post the books on the blog! Strangers might be lurking...
As long as Israel supports... Israel, then he's an all right guy in my book!
One of my biggest problems with that idiot Bush is that he doesn't support Israel properly and he's always asking them to make concessions to the Palestinians / terrorists.
Instead Bush goes after the wrong bad guys like the Keystone cops. Bush and Rumsfeld ruined everything by acting like Tweedle-dum and Tweedle-dee dumber in Iraq.
Here's what I would have done instead.
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I don't think we needed to invent an excuse to attack Iraq, Iraq was a secular country and it was keeping Iran in check. Saddam had already been given the smackdown and was minding his P's and Q's. He was motivated not by fanaticism or religious idealism but by keeping his lavish life style. That's a guy who can be reasoned with.
I agree that we needed to attack someone after 9-11 and hit them hard and I would have gone after Iran. Iran is a theocracy and far more dangerous than Iraq. It was led by a terrorist and a holocaust revisionary and it has nuclear ambitions. It supports terrorism and exports terrorists. Attack them. Use missiles and bombs. Let them know that continuing to do that will be met with a nuclear deterrent.
You also go into Saudi Arabia and arrest Bin Laden's entire family and seize all of their assets. Do the same to anyone connected with the Hijackers. Hopefully you kill a bunch of them. Torture a bunch of soft rich relatives and I'll bet you one of them gives up Bin Laden's whereabouts. If Saudia Arabia doesn't cooperate like a true ally, you make it clear to them that you will do whatever it takes to bring their monarchy down.
Finally you strengthen your alliance with Israel, instead of doing what Bush has done and suggesting they give their hard-won territories back to the Palestinians who lost the war fair and square.
The occupation of any of these Muslim countries is foolhardy. No way do you allow them to set up a western style democracy so they can vote in whatever Iman happens to be most popular. If you are going to be in Iraq, you set up a puppet government and maybe draft a Kurd who has had his family gassed by Saddam and put him in charge. Let him rule with an iron fist as long as he does exactly what we ask him to do, just like we used to do with Saddam when he was our ally. Make them pay for the costs of the occupation and of their security with oil.
That's how you get the attention and respect of those fanatics.
This is a holy war between Fundamentalist Radical Islamists and the Judeo-Christian / non-Islamists. We must take no prisoners and we must be prepared to destroy all terrorists and terrorist sympathizers. It may take the utter annihilation of a prominent holy city or two before they start to realize that maybe terrorism is no longer "the Will of Allah."
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Instead what we have now is a foolhardy non-war and occupation that has drained our nation's resources and more importantly has sapped the political resolve of our people.
Nothing is being accomplished and other tin-horn dictators have noticed. Iran's President has gained great political capital by rattling his sabers. All we did was get rid of Saddam, a guy who the Islamic Fundamentalists hated, and made Iran stronger.
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Is that liberal enough for you?
Sounds like a plan to me.
...perhaps I should have put more killing in my book?? c'mon...what did ya think?? Since you haven't emailed me back, I am guessing it is just too flag waving for you or something??? What??
Israel, I agree with your plan 100%. 2004ish, after the Iraq invasion, I read Bob Baer's book, See No Evil.
After reading I said - and I quote - "Good grief. We invaded the wrong country!"
If you were visionary enough to see that in 2002-2003 before we took out Saddam (remember, when the entire world thought they had WMDs) then you are to be applauded.
Yes, your plan has incredible merit. But, I guaran-darn-tee you there isn't a Democratic Senator in congress (Lieberman excepted) that would stand with you on it. They want to stand up to the Saudis and the Iranians (and their Russian puppeteers) even less than their GOP colleagues.
We've got a bunch of spineless, fat-faced, pork-bellied, low-lives running Congress and I don't see that changing anytime soon, no matter who's in power.
...and Sharla, if one of your kids' stories have rednecks sniping at Bambie with a .50 BMG, I'll buy two copies.
I love Jeremy and Beka's kids. They're the only ones I know who cheer the hunters in Bambie.
Paul-Michael! Wha..? How did you get a copy of my book?? I can't believe you've read it already! Now you've gone and given away the plot! Now EVERYBODY will be writng kids books about redneck hunters and exploding deer guts, but I am ahead of the curve on this one. As soon as Palin was put on the ticket, I put her in as the main character and changed the deer to a moose! It's sure to be a best seller.
Well the problem was that the Idiotic Republican President and his advisers were purposely ignoring intelligence and out-and-out lying to us about WMDs and that is why people supported the incompetent President's vendetta against Saddam. He wanted to do what his daddy didn't (get rid of Saddam, without a thought for what was the best course of action.)
Everyone would have signed off on any plan he would have rolled out after 911 because our nation was united at that point.
I didn't have to read any books to come up with my plan all I needed was simple common sense and a rudimentary understanding of mideast politics.
Bush had neither and that's why he embarked on his pie-in-the-sky-we -will-turn-the-Iraqi's-into-us and they will love us plan.
Idiotic President, Idiotic Plan, Idiotic Execution, Idiotic Results.
It's almost criminal arrogance and stupidity if you ask me. We can be there for 100 years and they will still hate us, but McCain is willing to do that, just to make a politic point (we didn't screw up.)
Sharla what format is your book in is it Microsoft Word?
I'll try to read it when I get the chance.
Yea, I did it in Word. It will take three minutes to read, it is written for 3-7 year olds.
please just read it and put me out of my misery!
Baer's book isn't about policy. It's a spook book - espionage and guns - which is why I read it. LOL.
He was embedded in the ME for a period and had a lot of first hand accounts of Iranian involvement in terrorist activities. They really are the head of the snake.
Yeah, Saddam and Iraq were actually our allies in the "Enemy of my enemy is my friend" kind of way."
Saddam had already learned his lesson. Now we have a destabilized region and factions loyal to Iran to deal with instead of an Iraq that has been keeping Iran in check.
I've been saying this for years on John and Jeshanah's blog but these nincompoops can't admit that George Bush has ever made a mistake because they declared Bush "God's candidate" a long time ago. As is so typical of Republicans they can't admit that they made a mistake.
You should have heard them talking about Bush like he sat at the right hand of God or something.
It was disgusting and it continued even after proof of Bush and the Republican Party's hypocrisy was right there in the open.
The only thing I can compare it to is people in the Catholic Church who keep following along blindly even though priests are molesting little boys right and left. It's too difficult to think for yourself so they keep following the herd.
I know Church-goers like to compare themselves to sheep, but this is ridiculous and really Baaaaaad...
Baaaaaad...
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